Bolt head locked to carrier

[Mortal_Wombat]

I think i've done a dumb thing, while working on my new cetme locked the bolt head against the carrier and now i for the life of me cant get the thing to come apart. i could really use some help lol.

[Smokehouse69]

Do you have a barrel in the trunnion, if not just take the long part of the bolt carrier and tap it firmly on a carpeted surface. It should pop right out.
If the barrel is in then grab hold of the barrel and whack the end of the carrier with a dead blow hammer.
That is if it is not in a receiver. If it is then, you can unlock it by pressing the bolt release tab on the side of the bolt carrier or taking a thin flat screwdriver and carefully pry the bolt away from the carrier.

[Mortal_Wombat]

yeah i tried pressing it in, it just doesnt want to budge.
this is all out of a century cetme that i just got and i was trying to clean it up and check everything out. that went well LOL.
edit: i take that back i got em apart with a flatblad, thanks a ton :D
one more question i noticed inside the receiver that it looks like the rollers have been trying to lock early causing a couple of flat spots about a 1/4" before the trunnion, any ideas?

[bladeworks123]

If the bolt carrier is out of the receiver, simply hold the carrier in your left hand and rotate the bolt head a quarter turn with a crescent wrench and it will pop right back out. Then just rotate it back level again, a lot easier than prying it with the screwdriver. When you have time, it will help you a lot to watch the bolt carrier videos here...it sure did me.

http://www.militaryfirearm.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=638

[jfowl31]

Insert bolt and carrier backwards into receiver... smack carrier with a deadblow hammer or with your palm if you have gorilla hands... this is the "field" remedy for getting the bolt locked. This is the only way I bother doing it personally... Everything else requires getting tools of some sort... I like the caveman style stick it in backwards and smack it method.

I've done this a bunch of times, with no noticeable effect on either the bolt (it gets smacked around quite a bit you know) nor the receiver rails at the rear... i doesn't take much force really, so it won't peen the rails unless you did it a few hundred times I don'think.

[texlurch]

one more question i noticed inside the receiver that it looks like the rollers have been trying to lock early causing a couple of flat spots about a 1/4" before the trunnion, any ideas?

With the carrier out, look down the receiver where the rails meet the trunnion; are they square with the opening and not cocked? If the trunnion is a bit off-center it causes the rollers to pop out for a second before it can twist itself into the opening. No easy fix. Depending on how the receiver is welded, you may be able to pinch the rails in slighty to help it out.

Detailed pics would help.

[97th Signalman]

If I happen to lock up my bolt head while at home I just place the bolt head in my soft jawed vice and tighten it to squeeze the rollers back in and...click...the bolt head snaps back out. It couldn't be simpler.

In the field I smack it into the receiver backwards as described above. That squeezes the rollers back in just like the vice does when I'm at home in my shop.

[BIGKID]

I made a tool for it out of a $1 harbor freight c-clamp (they were on sale). Get one that will go around the carrier and remove the flat swivel piece on the end. It places pressure on the bolt retaining lever and you can slide the bolt foreward. It takes the place of the $20 tool HK parts sells. I got tired of using a swrewdriver and cutting my mand when it slipped.

http://www.hkparts.net/shop/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=785&idcategory=8

[Nazgul]

Just insert it backwards and use some force too. It will unlock, and then pull it out. easy.

[drine]

Insert bolt and carrier backwards into receiver... smack carrier with a deadblow hammer or with your palm if you have gorilla hands... this is the "field" remedy for getting the bolt locked. This is the only way I bother doing it personally... Everything else requires getting tools of some sort... I like the caveman style stick it in backwards and smack it method.

I've done this a bunch of times, with no noticeable effect on either the bolt (it gets smacked around quite a bit you know) nor the receiver rails at the rear... i doesn't take much force really, so it won't peen the rails unless you did it a few hundred times I don'think.

+1 Jordan...Just turn it around, start it in the receiver then give a pop. I hold mine like a pounding fist. THIS is the way pointed out in one of the old manuals Mike the ELEC has on the web. I'm not jamming a screwdriver in anything especially my hand. This is the way, taught and trained to those Spanish and German GIs whose used it.

[BIGKID]

You guys are 100% correct. When in the field that is the best/easy way to do it. However, when I don't have the rifle handy, the pressure method on the bolt catch works best. At least for me...
When I built my first couple I didn't even have a receiver, just the parts.

[jfowl31]

The easiest way without doing the receiver trick is just rotating the bolt to release it... just need channel locks or an adjustable wrench both of which always seem to be close by.

[Mortal_Wombat]

well i checked the bolt gap and its fine at .012
i looked closer and the trunnion and while the rails are at a 90 to the thing
they dont sit flush at the edge of it, they sit maybe a mm back could that cause the dimples?

[bladeworks123]

It could if the bolt head is hitting on the trunion on the way in. If it is, you will usually experience a partial lock up when you drop the bolt from the locked open position. Pull the charging handle full back and lock it open. Slap the release and let it slam shut. Roll the rifle upside down and see if the bolt is locked up. Do that several times and see if you get any failures to fully lock into battery. Like Texlurch said earlier, it really depends on how the receiver was welded,,,whether or not the trunnion was welded at the end of the rails. I have seen some that are not and that can cause your problem, but is an easier fix than if the trunnion and rails were welded together like they are supposed to be. Some pics of how your trunnion is welded in would help.

[texlurch]

Is there are weld where the rail meets the trunnion? If not, you can get a piece of flat bar that fits inside the rail, install carrier without bolt backwards, and try squeezing the rails in a little bit.

[Mortal_Wombat]

i tried that and it seems to lock up fine every time, i saw in another thread someone mentioned the bolt head catch spring. if thats worn can that cause the dimples?

[bladeworks123]

The underlying cause is anything that obstructs the bolt head from entering the trunnion. Roller pin stucking up to high. Bolt head hiting on the sides of the trunnion because the rails are too wide, like you mentioned. Trunnion not clocked corectly to align with the rails. I would look to see if your rails are welded to the trunnion like Texlurch suggested. or look for any signs of wear on the leading edges, top and sides of the bolt head.

[Mortal_Wombat]

the parkerizing is fairly worn on the bolt head
bah lol, i'll try and find a digital camera to get a good picture of everything, all i've got right now a camera phone which takes horrible ones.

[bladeworks123]

Does your receiver still have the open slots like this...

17460

Or is it welded like this one???....

17461

[Mortal_Wombat]

it looks partially welded like alot of other century receivers i've seen

[brewskzilla]

Wombat... In response to your signature... WE did. There's a thread on here somewhere about the Mosin Nagant being the gateway drug to all of this. It's SO true! LMAO!

[BIGKID]

I have 2 Century builds and they have next to no weld. Probably some sort of tac weld. The one remaining bulid I did looks similar to the photo. I built 4 of these before I had someone point out I wasn't doing it right. Looking back it was due to my using the Century builds as guides. However of all the buiilds I have done, none had ground bolts and all are still running. Of all the Century builds I have had (and had), they are 50-50 at best.
Great info, again, bladeworks123.

[Mortal_Wombat]

the pin on the top of the bolt has been rubbing on the trunnion, i think thats whats causing it or was causing it, i can actually ride the bolt into the trunnion then lock the bolt into it with just a bit of finger force, so it looks like the previous owner may have already fixed the issue! :D everything else about the gun seems great, g3 magazines look in ultra tight (the cetme ones flop around) and it strips rounds from the mag no problem
and the barrel is like new too, only thing that im worried about now is that there may not be a cocking tube gap (not sure gonna mess with it tomorrow)

[bladeworks123]

If that roller retainer plate pin is sticking up out of the bolt, you should try to correct that by pushing it down flush or replacing it if it looks damaged.

[Mortal_Wombat]

it had a spot where it had been rubbing, but its flush now, so i think the previous owner found the problem and fixed it. the top of the pin is still quite polished from hitting the trunnion. i tapped it in a little below the surface to just make sure.
i wouldn't have even noticed this if it wasnt for the other guys thread.