Historical Observations

[Seattlefungus]

About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new
constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor
at the University of Edinburgh , had this to say about the fall of
the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years earlier:*

*"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist
as a permanent form of government."*

*"A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters
discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public
treasury."*

*"From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates
who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the
result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose
fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship."*

*"The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the
beginning of history, has been about 200 years."*

*"During those 200 years, those nations always progressed through
the following sequence:*

*1. from bondage to spiritual faith;*

*2. from spiritual faith to great courage;*

*3. from courage to liberty;*

*4. from liberty to abundance;*

*5. from abundance to complacency;*

*6. from complacency to apathy;*

*7. from apathy to dependence;*

*8. From dependence back into bondage"*

*Professor Joseph Olson of Hamline University School of Law, St.
Paul , Minnesota , points out some interesting facts concerning the
2000 Presidential election:*

*Number of States won by:*

*Gore: 19*

*Bush: 29*

*Square miles of land won by:*

*Gore: 580,000*

*Bush: 2,427,000*

*Population of counties won by:*

*Gore: 127 million*

*Bush: 143 million*

*Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by:*
**

*Gore: 13.2*

*Bush: 2.1*

*Professor Olson adds: "In aggregate, the map of the territory Bush
won was mostly the land owned by the taxpaying citizens of this
great country. Gore's territory mostly encompassed those citizens
living in government-owned tenements and living off various forms of
government welfare..."*

*Olson believes the United States is now somewhere between the
"complacency and apathy" phase of Professor Tyler's definition of
democracy, with some forty percent of the nation's population
already having reached the "governmental dependency" phase.*

*If Congress grants amnesty and citizenship to twenty million
criminal invaders called illegals and they vote, it makes one wonder
just HOW LONG DO WE HAVE? We can say goodbye to the USA in fewer
than five years.*

*Pass this along to help everyone realize just how much is at stake,
knowing that APATHY is the GREATEST DANGER TO OUR FREEDOM.*
**

"Price of freedom is eternal vigilance."
Thomas Jefferson
(...This could be said about not only our physical freedom but
our spiritual freedom as well!)

[Tread_Head]

Good read, though I hold out hope for our country. Don't forget, most of our military personnel vote toward to political right, so without their support, the government can't suppress its people violently.

[okie shooter]

I am reading the stats quoted above, there is plenty of cherry picking of those numbers, because I am sure that the other side can do the same cherry picking too. (on the issue of land ownership, I imagine the states that bush won, were also heavly covered with BLM or other goverment or tribal owned land too, thus the land owning argument might be moot with that stat, for example bush won alaska, utah, nevada, and most of the interior west, much of it is goverment land)

If you want to take the time to look at the numbers and much of the data your self, go here and look around, become more edcuated about the process and actually where much of the claims come from. Almost any one can get what ever they want the numbers to say if they actually want too.

http://www.uselectionatlas.org/RESULTS/national.php?f=0&year=2000

The election process is a leftover from a age before technology and such thus the huge time lapse from when the election is held, to canvessing(look the term up, its interesting) to certification by states, to certification by congress.(look up the 3/5 compromise some time to see how the process worked at one time too)

The electorial college works for smaller states rights in many ways, as it follows the congress, each state has a mininum of three electors, one for each senator, and one for each house member, thus no matter what the population there is a skew for electors, due to the colleges make up of 538 rather than 438, which would track population. (dc gets three electors as if it would have members of congress too, thus 435 reps, 100 senators, plus three for dc) Bush won five of the eight states that get the bennifit of getting three electors at mininum no matter how small the population, gore took dc, vermont, and delware, bush took alaska, montana, wyoming, north and south dakota.

In forty eight states the winner takes all of the electors, thus this is a interesting subject if you want to play with numbers, staticits and such.

Heres a site that explains the electorial college a little

http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/electoral-college/about.html

[M1 Tanker]

http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/tyler.asp

This thing is seven years old and not all true.

[SteelCore]

Ya beat me to it.

Folks, it pays to check snopes.com or urban legend archive BEFORE you post that chain email.:thumbup:

[Seattlefungus]

My bad, I usually check scopes 1st. But thought it was not more outrageous than the Colorado University PHD teaching that the Holocaust never happened (He was fired by the Governor) and a Chicago University Prof that teaches that all male sex with females is rape (she is still teaching)...

[SteelCore]

And I scoured Snopes when that one about the judge's monologue to Richard Reid came around.

[Seattlefungus]

Yeah, but the Reid one was true... (I'm taking back pain meds is my only defense)... what would an 18th century Scotsman know about a dictator form of government... And the argument about giving oneself benefits was used in describing the decline of the Roman Empire when they began the "Dole" system... Which stifled initiative and innovation on the part of the people...