PTR91 Receivers

[renegade]

Can someone confirm or deny these noob beliefs in regards to building a CETME?

1) True or false. If one uses a PTR91 Receiver, will it utilize HK recoil assembly, with simply turning down the small nylon washer? (this includes butt plate etc.)
2) It is my understanding the since the PTR 91 is in spec with HK tooling, most HK external parts will work with little or no adaptaion.
3) True or false. This is not true of a cast SS Century.

I am in the process of buying some kits and was wondering before, I bought things. Just want some clarification. Also, I do not have access to presses, so I will be sending the receiver barrel work out for assembly. Can some one recommend anyone?

[Lon Moer]

Can someone confirm or deny these noob beliefs in regards to building a CETME?

1) True or false. If one uses a PTR91 Receiver, will it utilize HK recoil assembly, with simply turning down the small nylon washer?
You only need to worry about the recoil rod washer when using an HK stock hanger and a CETME bolt carrier. Which receiver doesn't matter.


As far as using a PTR receiver for a CETME build, they are nicer than the CIA, but;
- the receiver comes with a HK rear sight base. You'll need to carefully remove that and replace it with a CETME rear sight.
- the barrel pin hole is drilled for a HK trunnion (and lines up perfect with my G3 trunnions), but is off by about half the hole size for a CETME trunnion. However, the CIA receivers are not drilled for the barrel pin at all.

[Ransom Stoddard]

...It is my understanding the since the PTR 91 is in spec with HK tooling, most HK external parts will work with little or no adaptaion...
The PTR-91 receivers are manufactured on HK tooling...
using HK drawings...
and specifications purchased from the Portuguese government.
The cast CAI is a reverse-engineered receiver.

[19k40ret]

i purchased a prt91 receiver without a rear sight base, and used it to replace the CAI receiver. had a new cetme barrel and triple frame with grenade rings, installed at the same time. all parts other than receiver are cetme. g3, thermold and cetme mags work in it without feed problems, but the cetme mags are a little loose.

[jfowl31]

Can someone confirm or deny these noob beliefs in regards to building a CETME?

1) True or false. If one uses a PTR91 Receiver, will it utilize HK recoil assembly, with simply turning down the small nylon washer? (this includes butt plate etc.)
2) It is my understanding the since the PTR 91 is in spec with HK tooling, most HK external parts will work with little or no adaptaion.
3) True or false. This is not true of a cast SS Century.


1) TRUE, But also true for any other receiver, including both stamped and case Cetme receivers. I have G3 furniture (recoil rod, backplate, buffer... the whole shebang) on my Cetme and many others do as well.

2) TRUE, A PTR receiver will accept a scope mount with no fitting at all. A cast Cetme receiver will as well, but may require a slight bit of fitting. A port buffer will work on both the PTR receiver and a CAI stamped receiver, but will not work on a CAST I'm told. Carry handles work on all 3... DOn't know what other external parts that would apply to the receiver.

3) Century cast receivers take HK furniture just fine once you remove material from the plastic retainer, or replace it with a Cetme steel retainer... as stated earlier, what keeps HK furniture from being dopped in is the Cetme carrier having a smaller ID than the HK carrier. My cast receiver took a scope mount with VerY minimal fitting. I ended up just taking the paint off the bottom of the scope lugs to get a HK clamp-on to lock nice and tight. I've also got a carry handle installed on my Cetme, and it went on without a hitch. I've never personally tried to put on a port buffer mainly due to the cost, but Ive been told it wont fit a cast receiver.

[Ransom Stoddard]

CETME/HK-G3 Compatibility
(HK parts that will work on your CETME)

Barrels - Yes
Barrel Retainer Pins - Yes
Firing Pin - Yes*
Spring, for firing pin - Yes*
Rollers - Yes
+2, +4 Rollers - Yes
Retainer Plate and Roll Pin Retainer for Rollers - Yes
Extractor - Yes*
Extractor Spring - Yes*
Recoil Spring - Yes*
Backplate or Complete recoil Assembly - Yes
(with minor fitting to the plastic sleeve at the end of the spring guide rod)
Complete Stock set - Yes
(with minor fitting to the plastic sleeve at the end of the spring guide rod)
Collapsible Stock - Yes
(with minor fitting to the plastic sleeve at the end of the spring guide rod)
Buttstock - Yes
(with minor fitting - needs the buffer hole matched to use the CETME buffer)
Grip Frames - Yes
Complete Trigger Pack - Yes (but no individual parts)
Rear Sight - Yes (but only if entire sight base is swapped)
Handguards, Slim - Yes
Handguards Wide - Yes with minor fitting.
(Just like the old style HK triple frame,
the CETME has a bipod retaining ring that prevents the wide from installing)
Pistol Grip - Yes
Triple Frames - Yes
Flash Hider - Yes
Eyeloop for triple frame - Yes
Cocking Handle - Yes*
Spring for cocking handle - Yes*
Pivot Pin for cocking handle - Yes
Mag Catch parts - Yes
Paddle mag release - Yes
End Cap, Dust Cover Yes - (but CETME will not fit g3)
Bayonet Adapter - Yes*
Bayonet - Yes* (only when using adapter)
Retainer Pins - Yes*
Blank Firing Adapter - Yes
Claw, Stanag Scope Mount - Yes(with modification)
Carry handle - Yes
(carry handle slight modification to CETME handguard)

* = these items not only interchange but are an improvement over existing CETME parts.**
Over the years some items have been strengthened or improved by HK.

No - The below HK parts will not work on a CETME:
Trunions - No
Bolt Carriers - No
Locking Lever for bolt carrier - No
Bolt Head - No
Locking Piece - No
Cocking Tube - No
Support for Cocking Handle - No
Recoil Buffer - No (unless using HK buttstock)
Individual fire control group parts like trigger, sear, hammer - No

Thanks Robert!
@ RTG International Surplus Parts
http://www.robertrtg.com

ps: Jose Diaz's receiver(PTR91) has the recesses...
(for engaging the original scope claw mount) CNC machined...
with the proper angles - for proper claw mount operation.
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/5369/ptr91jldreceiverkg4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/8017/ptr91receivergb7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
PTR91 receiver w/ Latest Generation(made in Oberndorf) HK collapsible stock.


pps: Anyone remember when JLD Enterprises (Jose Luis Diaz)...
used to use the “Americanized” name JL Denter...:wink:
“JLD ENT FARM CT”
"JLD Enterprises"
"Farmington,CT"
(same co. w/ addition of partner now PTR91 Inc.)
& used to sell Military Surplus Firearms –
like rifles & pistols from Latin & South America – to the collector community???:thumbup:
(Hmmm... Star .45's, Army & Police Pistola Colt Modelo's, Sistema Colt's,
Mauser Calvary Carbines, even GI FAL barrels...)
My... Time flies!

[renegade]

Who did the work? with your replacement?

[renegade]

Who does this work? I tried angelfire to see if they still did work, NO.
I am not sure, but if I remember my my ATF (unless this part has changed in the last 20 years). Some portions of re-machining or barrel fitting, etc, may have to be someone with manufacturers license. So,
I do not know if this is the case anymore, but, I am trying to locate some one to do the parts I cannot do.

[renegade]

Sorry, I guess I'm hijacking my own thread. Maybe this is a new topic...

[19k40ret]

Arizona Expert Arms (AZEXARMS.COM) did the rebuilt for me.

[Onthesquare]

"2) most HK external parts will work", sorry don't know now to quote. There are alot of misconceptions on what will work and wont, and why. And then we get to, what can be made to work. 1st there is a difference between the HK and Cetme receiver in the rear, it's just smidgen, but enough that the butt stock pins wont align without a bit of milling, your smith will do it, no sweat. Then we get to the cocking tube/carrier extension tube length, they are very different, and then there's the recoil spring retainer diameter, cnange the retainer was my easy answer. Sorry to poop on the parade, but there are alot of unanswered questions here.

As for build guys, AXEX, ARS, IGF, sad to hear Angelfire gave up Cetme's, he did some damn fine work. There's a guy in southern Illinois, forget his name, does great work.

[jfowl31]

a Cetme carrier tube will work percectly with a PTR receiver as long as a Cetme carrier is used.

Noone will need to change the recoil spring retainer unless the want to use G3 parts. Since he says he is building a Cetme with a Cetme parts kit, one would assume he is using Cetme furniture.

I've never heard of the stock pins being out of line on a PTR receiver, but thats an easy fix with a file while the receiver is still in the white, and even the Cast SS Cetme receivers require this step for proper fitting of the buttstock

[Lon Moer]

You only need to worry about the recoil rod washer when using an HK stock hanger and a CETME bolt carrier. Which receiver doesn't matter.


As far as using a PTR receiver for a CETME build, they are nicer than the CIA, but;
- the receiver comes with a HK rear sight base. You'll need to carefully remove that and replace it with a CETME rear sight.
- the barrel pin hole is drilled for a HK trunnion (and lines up perfect with my G3 trunnions), but is off by about half the hole size for a CETME trunnion. However, the CIA receivers are not drilled for the barrel pin at all.
I remembered another point.
- the CETME buffer in the stock does not fit the rear of the PTR receiver. I had to remove the buffer and trim some of the face off and shape it to fit the back of the receiver. Strictly cosmetic, but then hidden when the rifle is assembled.
:g3: