PDA

View Full Version : Senate passes gun bill in response to rampage



Longhorn789
12-19-2007, 06:57 PM
By Thomas Ferraro

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Congress, prodded by the deadliest shooting rampage in modern American history, passed legislation on Wednesday designed to keep guns out of the hands of the mentally ill.

Without objection, the Senate and House of Representatives approved the measure, which would bolster background checks for gun buyers, and sent it to President George W. Bush to sign.

The measure would be the first major new gun-control law in more than a decade. It was drafted after a deranged gunman killed himself and 32 others in April at Virginia Tech university.

The product of months of talks, the bill was finally agreed to as lawmakers prepared to wrap up their work for the year and head home for the holidays.

"Together, we have crafted a bill that will prevent gun violence, but maintain the Second Amendment rights of law-abiding citizens" to bear arms, said Democratic Rep. Carolyn McCarthy of New York, a chief sponsor of the bill. Her husband was killed and son injured in 1993 when a gunman opened fire on a train.

The 4 million-member National Rifle Association, which has helped stop numerous gun-control bills as one of the nation's most powerful pro-gun lobbying groups, backed this one.

"This is good public policy," said NRA spokesman Andrew Arulanandam.

Americans are among the world's most heavily armed people, and the country has one of the world's highest murder rates

There are an estimated 250 million privately owned guns in the United States, which has a population of about 300 million. About 30,000 people a year die from gun wounds.

Congress has long been reluctant to tackle the politically explosive issue of gun control. But it did so after it was disclosed that the Virginia Tech gunman had once been deemed by a judge to be dangerous and the information never reached a background check system for gun buyers.

The legislation would provide financial incentives for states to provide mental health and criminal records to a database used for federal background checks on gun buyers.

UPDATING DATABASE

The 1968 Gun Control Act prohibits anyone found by a court to be "a mental defective" from possessing a gun. It also bars felons, fugitives, drug addicts and wife beaters.

But because of state privacy laws and fiscal restraints, most states have failed to fully report such records to the National Instant Criminal Background Check System.

McCarthy said: "Today, we are one step closer to making sure the National Instant Background Check System does what it was it was designed to do -- keep guns out of the hands of convicted felons, individuals subjected to restraining orders, those charged with domestic violence and individuals deemed mentally ill by a court of law."

The House initially passed such a bill in June. But the Senate refused to go along with it until a few changes were made. One would require the government to pay legal fees if a person who claims to have been wrongly listed in the background system wins an appeal.

Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy, a Vermont Democrat and a sponsor of the bill, said: "Nothing can bring back the lives tragically lost at Virginia Tech, and no legislation can be a panacea, but the bill we pass today will begin to repair and restore our faith in the NICS system and may help prevent similar tragedies in the future."

(Editing by David Alexander and Eric Beech)

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSN1962838820071220?pageNumber=1&virtualBrandChannel=0

hackrider
12-19-2007, 07:14 PM
So what does the bill do besides provide money to the states to update databases?

Hack

MID
12-19-2007, 07:19 PM
Wtf


There are an estimated 250 million privately owned guns in the United States, which has a population of about 300 million. About 30,000 people a year die from gun wounds.


That number is wrong, of the 30,000 people that die. Over Half of them are suicide. So its realy 14,000 people that needlessly die. Which is alot less then what cigarrettes kill each year@ 400,000 , or cars@45,000 Source; cdc mortality reports.

ELEFANTMKVI (The Inbred clown)
12-19-2007, 08:00 PM
Wtf



That number is wrong, of the 30,000 people that die. Over Half of them are suicide. So its realy 14,000 people that needlessly die. Which is alot less then what cigarrettes kill each year@ 400,000 , or cars@45,000 Source; cdc mortality reports.

Yes, and about another 70 to 80 per cent of those other 14,000 are gangbangers, pimps and drugdealers shooting each other.:rockon::2pistol:

ctdemolay0405
12-19-2007, 08:25 PM
reguardless, i really dont have a problem with outlawing mentally ill people not getting guns. i mean, yes, they use the 30,000 number, etc without explaining it (like that suicides will probably happen reguardless of gun or rope or knife, etc) but its not the worst piece of gun legislation, i've long come to accept that we have to have some gun control, to please the hippies, but this isnt that restrictive

SSwee
12-19-2007, 09:54 PM
The excuse of not reporting mental defects due to privacy issues or statutes is BS. It's the same BS as HIV positive people putting others at risk but don't have to tell them they are at risk. I witnessed and assisted an auto crash late one night. The guy was drunk and had blood all over him from running his car under a parked semi trailer. After APD arrived and took over the scene, they took my statement and asked if I had any open wounds on me. I asked if the guy was HIV Pos. and they told me that they could not give me that info due to privacy laws but they would wash up extra well and got some kill everything wipes from the paramedics. Makes you stop and think twice about helping anyone now days.
SS

nowhereman
12-20-2007, 07:11 AM
The excuse of not reporting mental defects due to privacy issues or statutes is BS. It's the same BS as HIV positive people putting others at risk but don't have to tell them they are at risk. I witnessed and assisted an auto crash late one night. The guy was drunk and had blood all over him from running his car under a parked semi trailer. After APD arrived and took over the scene, they took my statement and asked if I had any open wounds on me. I asked if the guy was HIV Pos. and they told me that they could not give me that info due to privacy laws but they would wash up extra well and got some kill everything wipes from the paramedics. Makes you stop and think twice about helping anyone now days.
SS

Come work in a hospital, once a bloody prisoner came bolting out the front door where I was taking a break. I got jumped on by security who runs about 60-80 yrs in age for not tackling the guy. Huh.,, covered in blood!!! Later I found out he was Hep C pos. Yeah I feel terrible. Code strongs everyday.... But bloody KTbar the door wait on the cops.

Longhorn789
12-20-2007, 07:27 AM
Senate Passes NICS Improvement Act
After months of careful negotiation, pro-gun legislation was passed through Congress today. The National Rifle Association (NRA) worked closely with Senator Tom Coburn (R-Okla.) to address his concerns regarding H.R. 2640, the National Instant Check System (NICS) Improvement Act. These changes make a good bill even better. The end product is a win for American gun owners.

The NICS Improvement Act does the following:


Permanently prohibits the FBI from charging a "user fee" for NICS checks.

Requires all federal agencies that impose mental health adjudications or commitments to provide a process for "relief from disabilities." Extreme anti-gun groups like the Violence Policy Center and Coalition to Stop Gun Violence have expressed "strong concerns" over this aspect of the bill-surely a sign that it represents progress for gun ownership rights.

Prevents reporting of mental adjudications or commitments by federal agencies when those adjudications or commitments have been removed.

Requires removal of expired, incorrect or otherwise irrelevant records. Today, totally innocent people (e.g., individuals with arrest records, who were never convicted of the crime charged) are sometimes subject to delayed or denied firearm purchases because of incomplete records in the system.

Provides a process of error correction if a person is inappropriately committed or declared incompetent by a federal agency. The individual would have an opportunity to correct the error-either through the agency or in court.

Prevents use of federal "adjudications" that consist only of medical diagnoses without findings that the people involved are dangerous or mentally incompetent. This would ensure that purely medical records are never used in NICS. Gun ownership rights would only be lost as a result of a finding that the person is a danger to themselves or others, or lacks the capacity to manage his own affairs.

Improves the accuracy and completeness of NICS by requiring federal agencies and participating states to provide relevant records to the FBI. For instance, it would give states an incentive to report those who were adjudicated by a court to be "mentally defective," a danger to themselves, a danger to others or suicidal.

Requires a Government Accountability Office audit of past NICS improvement spending.
The bill includes significant changes from the version that previously passed the House, including:


Requires incorrect or outdated records to be purged from the system within 30 days after the Attorney General learns of the need for correction.

Requires agencies to create "relief from disabilities" programs within 120 days, to prevent bureaucratic foot-dragging.

Provides that if a person applies for relief from disabilities and the agency fails to act on the application within a year-for any reason, including lack of funds-the applicant can seek immediate review of his application in federal court.

Allows awards of attorney's fees to applicants who successfully challenge a federal agency's denial of relief in court.

Requires that federal agencies notify all people being subjected to a mental health "adjudication" or commitment process about the consequences to their firearm ownership rights, and the availability of future relief.

Earmarks 3-10% of federal implementation grants for use in operating state "relief from disabilities" programs.

Elimination of all references to Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives regulations defining adjudications, commitments, or determinations related to Americans' mental health. Instead, the bill uses terms previously adopted by the Congress.

flint_knapper
12-21-2007, 06:22 AM
this is a good way to disarm any and ALL vets, now why would
the .gov want to disarm a great amount of the returning warriors?

All it takes is some anti-gun Doc to say someone is unstable, and they
just have been disarmed by this bill.

now who do you really trust with YOUR GOD given Responsiblities?
I sure don't trust the nra or any politician!

Phirebug
12-21-2007, 07:07 AM
they've been able to do that since 1968. this bill doesn't change that. this just makes it so that when they DO find someone unstable, the information actually makes it to the NICS. it also implements a process for getting your gun rights BACK.

nonetheless, i do agree with you. i see this bill biting vets in the ass down the road.

rustypirate
12-21-2007, 11:27 AM
The fact remains that none of these changes would have prevented the shooting at VT.

While the shooter there did see a doctor about mental issues at the request of a court hearing, the judge in that hearing refrained from putting it on the young man's record, (which kept it hidden from the NICS check), for fear of hurting the man's character.

SteelCore
12-21-2007, 12:39 PM
I almost think some of the 'system cleanup' at NICS has already begun, lemme explain:

For my last 4 of 5 gun purchases, I had a hold put on me. I could not figure out why...what changed?

Anyhow, my last purchase was yesterday, and it went thu with no hold! They might have cleaned something up already. I've been messed with on 4 puchas ove 18months, but now it went thru easy.

Seattlefungus
12-23-2007, 04:23 PM
LOL, Steelcore, they've probably been reading your posts and question your sanity!!:bubba:

Big Steve
12-23-2007, 05:14 PM
Even if all these laws worked 100% of the time and you kept every nut case that was hell bent on taking a bunch of people out from obtaining a firearm. Whats going to keep them from doing it by other means? Cars,bombs,poison,planes,trains can all be used to commit mass murder.
All these things drive home the fact that honest sane citizens must always be able to arm and protect themselves! Because the government will never be able to protect us as well as we can protect ourselves!
Steve

SSwee
12-23-2007, 05:23 PM
Then they may need to have a NICS check on imitation swords, baseball bats and everything else that could be used as a weapon. Or they can just start making the stuff illegal. IE: swords in GB
As is usual they band aid the symptoms instead of dealing with the cause.
SS

SteelCore
12-27-2007, 07:49 AM
Heh! They were prolly wondering if I ate some Seattle fungus er sumthin.
:eek:
:bash:
:rockon:
:sleepy:

Woodman in MO
12-27-2007, 10:18 AM
I want to know why with every other damn bill there are hundreds if not thousands of little earmarks or riders attached.

Why can't they take on some things that put the ATF in check? I'm talking about the barrel ban and other goofy rulings the ATF made. Wishful thinking I know...