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k98k792
11-24-2008, 04:04 PM
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2008/11/ten_random_politically_incorre.html

Ten Random, Politically Incorrect Thoughts
By Victor Davis Hanson

1. Four years of high-school Latin would dramatically arrest the decline in American education. In particular, such instruction would do more for minority youths than all the 'role model' diversity sermons on Harriet Tubman, Malcolm X, Montezuma, and Caesar Chavez put together. Nothing so enriches the vocabulary, so instructs about English grammar and syntax, so creates a discipline of the mind, an elegance of expression, and serves as a gateway to the thinking and values of Western civilization as mastery of a page of Virgil or Livy (except perhaps Sophocles's Antigone in Greek or Thucydides' dialogue at Melos). After some 20 years of teaching mostly minority youth Greek, Latin, and ancient history and literature in translation (1984-2004), I came to the unfortunate conclusion that ethnic studies, women studies--indeed, anything "studies"-- were perhaps the fruits of some evil plot dreamed up by illiberal white separatists to ensure that poor minority students in the public schools and universities were offered only a third-rate education.

2. Hollywood is going the way of Detroit. The actors are programmed and pretty rather than interesting looking and unique. They, of course, are overpaid (they do to films what Lehman Brothers' execs did to stocks), mediocre, and politicized. The producers and directors are rarely talented, mostly unoriginal--and likewise politicized. A pack-mentality rules. Do one movie on a comic superhero--and suddenly we get ten, all worse than the first. One noble lion cartoon movie earns us eagle, penguin and most of Noah's Arc sequels. Now see poorer remakes of movies that were never good to begin with. I doubt we will ever see again a Western like Shane, the Searchers, High Noon, or the Wild Bunch. If one wishes to see a fine film, they are now usually foreign, such as Das Boot or Breaker Morant. Watching any recent war movie (e.g., Iraq as the Rape of Nanking) is as if someone put uniforms on student protestors and told them to consult their professors for the impromptu script.

3. All the old media brands of our youth have been tarnished and all but discredited. No one picks up Harpers or Atlantic expecting to read a disinterested story on politics or culture. (I pass on their inane accounts of 'getaways' and food.) The New York Times and Washington Post are as likely to have op-eds as news stories on the front page. Newsweek and Time became organs for paint-by-numbers Obamism, teased with People Magazine-like gossip pieces (at least, their editors still cared enough to seem hurt when charged with overt bias). NBC, ABC, and CBS would now make a Chet Huntley or Eric Sevareid turn over in his grave. A Keith Olbermann would not have been allowed to do commercials in the 1950s. Strangely, the media has offered up fashionably liberal politics coupled with metrosexual elite tastes in fashions, clothes, housing, food, and the good life, as if there were no contradictions between the two. No wonder media is so enthralled with the cool Obama and his wife. Both embody the new nexus between Eurosocialism in the abstract and the hip aristocratic life in the concrete.

4. After the junk bond meltdown, the S&L debacle, and now the financial panic, in just a few years the financial community destroyed the ancient wisdom: deal in personal trust; your word is your bond; avoid extremes; treat the money you invest for others as something sacred; don't take any more perks than you would wish others to take; don't borrow what you couldn't suddenly pay back; imagine the worse case financial scenario and expect it very may well happen; the wealthier you become the more humble you should act. And for what did our new Jay Goulds do all this? A 20,000 square-foot mansion instead of the old 6,000 sq. ft. expansive house? A Gulfstream in lieu of first class commercial? You milk your company, cash in your stock bonuses, enjoy your $50 million cash pile, and then get what--a Rolex instead of a reliable Timex? A Maserati for a Mercedes, a gold bathroom spout in preference to brushed pewter? The extra splurge was marginal and hardly worth the stain of avarice on one's immortal soul.

5. California is now a valuable touchstone to the country, a warning of what not to do. Rarely has a single generation inherited so much natural wealth and bounty from the investment and hard work of those more noble now resting in our cemeteries--and squandered that gift within a generation. Compare the vast gulf from old Governor Pat Brown to Gray Davis or Arnold Schwarzenegger. We did not invest in many dams, canals, rails, and airports (though we use them all to excess); we sued each other rather than planned; wrote impact statements rather than left behind infrastructure; we redistributed, indulged, blamed, and so managed all at once to create a state with about the highest income and sales taxes and the worst schools, roads, hospitals, and airports. A walk through downtown San Francisco, a stroll up the Fresno downtown mall, a drive along highway 101 (yes, in many places it is still a four-lane, pot-holed highway), an afternoon at LAX, a glance at the catalogue of Cal State Monterey, a visit to the park in Parlier--all that would make our forefathers weep. We can't build a new nuclear plant; can't drill a new offshore oil well; can't build an all-weather road across the Sierra; can't build a few tracts of new affordable houses in the Bay Area; can't build a dam for a water-short state; and can't create even a mediocre passenger rail system. Everything else--well, we do that well.

6. Something has happened to the generic American male accent. Maybe it is urbanization; perhaps it is now an affectation to sound precise and caring with a patina of intellectual authority; perhaps it is the fashion culture of the metrosexual; maybe it is the influence of the gay community in arts and popular culture. Maybe the ubiquitous new intonation comes from the scarcity of salty old jobs in construction, farming, or fishing. But increasingly to meet a young American male about 25 is to hear a particular nasal stress, a much higher tone than one heard 40 years ago, and, to be frank, to listen to a precious voice often nearly indistinguishable from the female. How indeed could one make Westerns these days, when there simply is not anyone left who sounds like John Wayne, Richard Boone, Robert Duvall, or Gary Cooper much less a Struther Martin, Jack Palance, L.Q. Jones, or Ben Johnson? I watched the movie Twelve O'clock High the other day, and Gregory Peck and Dean Jagger sounded liked they were from another planet. I confess over the last year, I have been interviewed a half-dozen times on the phone, and had no idea at first whether a male or female was asking the questions. All this sounds absurd, but I think upon reflection readers my age (55) will attest they have had the same experience. In the old days, I remember only that I first heard a variant of this accent with the old Paul Lynde character actor in one of the Flubber movies; now young men sound closer to his camp than to a Jack Palance or Alan Ladd.

7. We have given political eccentricity a bad name. There used to be all sorts of classy individualists, liberal and conservative alike, like Everett Dirksen, J. William Fulbright, Margaret Chase Smith, or Sam Ervin; today we simply see the obnoxious who claim to be eccentric like a Barbara Boxer, Al Franken, Barney Frank, or Harry Reid. The loss is detectable even in diction and manner; Dirksen was no angel, but he was witty, charming, insightful; Frank is no angel, but he merely rants and pontificates. Watch the You Tube exchange between Harvard Law Graduate Frank and Harvard Law Graduate Rains as they arrogantly dismiss their trillion-dollar Fannie/Freddie meltdown in the making. I suppose it is the difference between the Age of Belief and the Age of Nihilism.

8. Do not farm. There is only loss. To the degree that anyone makes money farming, it is a question of a vertically-integrated enterprise making more in shipping, marketing, selling, packing, and brokering than it loses on the other end in growing. No exceptions. Food prices stay high, commodity prices stay low. That is all ye need to know. Try it and see.

9. As I wrote earlier, the shrill Left is increasingly far more vicious these days than the conservative fringe, and about like the crude Right of the 1950s. Why? I am not exactly sure, other than the generic notion that utopians often believe that their anointed ends justify brutal means. Maybe it is that the Right already had its Reformation when Buckley and others purged the extremists--the Birchers, the neo-Confederates, racialists, the fluoride-in-the-water conspiracists, anti-Semites, and assorted nuts.--from the conservative ranks in a way the Left has never done with the 1960s radicals that now reappear in the form of Michael Moore, Bill Ayers, Cindy Sheehan, Moveon.org, the Daily Kos, etc. Not many Democrats excommunicated Moveon.org for its General Betray-Us ad. Most lined up to see the premier of Moore's mythodrama. Barack Obama could subsidize a Rev. Wright or email a post-9/11 Bill Ayers in a way no conservative would even dare speak to a David Duke or Timothy McVeigh--and what Wright said was not all that different from what Duke spouts. What separated Ayers from McVeigh was chance; had the stars aligned, the Weathermen would have killed hundreds as they planned.

10. The K-12 public education system is essentially wrecked. No longer can any professor expect an incoming college freshman to know what Okinawa, John Quincy Adams, Shiloh, the Parthenon, the Reformation, John Locke, the Second Amendment, or the Pythagorean Theorem is. An entire American culture, the West itself, its ideas and experiences, have simply vanished on the altar of therapy. This upcoming generation knows instead not to judge anyone by absolute standards (but not why so); to remember to say that its own Western culture is no different from, or indeed far worse than, the alternatives; that race, class, and gender are, well, important in some vague sense; that global warming is manmade and very soon will kill us all; that we must have hope and change of some undefined sort; that AIDs is no more a homosexual- than a heterosexual-prone disease; and that the following things and people for some reason must be bad, or at least must in public company be said to be bad (in no particular order): Wal-Mart, cowboys, the Vietnam War, oil companies, coal plants, nuclear power, George Bush, chemicals, leather, guns, states like Utah and Kansas, Sarah Palin, vans and SUVs.

Well, with that done--I feel much better.

Victor Davis Hanson is a classicist and historian at the Hoover Institution, Stanford University, and author, most recently, of "A War Like No Other: How the Athenians and Spartans Fought the Peloponnesian War." You can reach him by e-mailing author@victorhanson.com.

cfish
11-24-2008, 08:46 PM
Good post K98! He is spot on in his analysis of were this country has gone. Much of which I have been saying as well as others for a very long time.

xernex
11-24-2008, 09:01 PM
Now some of this...well most of it I agree with completely... 1 and 2 I have some problems with... but I've never agreed with anything more than number 6; Makes me wish Sam Elliot was available to punch em all in the face and show em what a real man is

Norton
11-24-2008, 09:09 PM
That was very sad to read.. A small footnote on one paragrah. I too Wonder what has happened to the normal American Male way of speaking..
Me a guy from Virginia sometimes feel more at home talking to the dude from Western Pa or Maine than my own kind who graduated from my own High School 30 years latter than me. I listen to these young guys who I know were born here and I think where the hell are you from ? We don't talk like that.

xernex
11-24-2008, 09:38 PM
Norton, I feel your pain... you should see how it is when I go to rock shows now... I fell not only incredibly old, at only 25 mind you, but I also wonder what happened to all the testosterone.... its gotta be something in the city water

jettag
11-24-2008, 10:15 PM
My youth have been dragging this kind of crap home with them from school!
I will not stand for it in my home. :nonono:
Sure kids are supposed to have fun, be kids, but the F@%ing booty dance does not fly here. Nor does bastardized English or general ignorance.
Thankful my kids have got some real warrior heroes :sparta:...

and two parents who give a damn. :love1::ranting:

Patria Povo
11-24-2008, 10:29 PM
Yeh, I gotta agree with no. 6. But it's nothing unique to the US - I've seen it almost everywhere in the developed/industralised world. Australia included.

When I was a kid, the oldies were decrying the influence of American TV - afraid that us kids would all start talking like yanks soon - John Wayne. That never happened, but it seems like just about everyone in the world now is talking like a teenage girl.

There was something kinda cool about Russell Crow playing a (very manly) gay rugby player in his 2nd movie. But this new generation seems to be purely androgynous. Not men, not women.

rustypirate
11-24-2008, 10:37 PM
Part of that is the idea that all violence is bad.

"Fighting never solves anything"

"We should be tollerant of each other and respect each other's views"

I call BS.

Some things should NEVER be tollerated by ANY society.

Some language and attitudes from children should NEVER be tollerated.

Hell, now you should not spank your kids, or your dog, you shuld use ENCOURAGEMENT and POSITIVE reinforcement.

BS!

If any child of mine ever uses foul language or mouths off to me, they can expect a smack in the chops.

Likewise, if my dog makes a mess in the house more than twice, he knows that I am going to drag him over into it and spank him. All the issues I have had with my dog have been resolved this way after trying the positive feedback crap with no success. Now he knows who is the boss, and behaves. He is still a happy well adjusted pup, and not in the least way abused.

rifleman
11-24-2008, 10:43 PM
aww you shouldnt hit your dog. ha, yeah right, my dog pissed me off the other day for chasing the neighbors dog while he was walking it. i was just getting home from another long day and gave that dog a nice walop. not to bad, but he got the point.

rustypirate
11-24-2008, 10:56 PM
Hell, I have been known to BITE my dog.

Sometimes you just have to "speak" dog.

rifleman
11-24-2008, 11:14 PM
you know on occasion i have to. sometimes a smack dont get it.

Grasshopper
11-25-2008, 01:59 PM
(deep breath sigh)
Ok, I'll post this again, well, just the link for the kiddies here.
http://www.uhuh.com/nwo/communism/comgoals.htm
15. Capture one or both of the political parties in the United States
16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions by claiming their activities violate civil rights.

17. Get control of the schools. Use them as transmission belts for socialism and current Communist propaganda. Soften the curriculum. Get control of teachers' associations. Put the party line in textbooks.

18. Gain control of all student newspapers.

20. Infiltrate the press. Get control of book-review assignments, editorial writing, policymaking positions.

21. Gain control of key positions in radio, TV, and motion pictures.

24. Eliminate all laws governing obscenity by calling them "censorship" and a violation of free speech and free press.

25. Break down cultural standards of morality by promoting pornography and obscenity in books, magazines, motion pictures, radio, and TV.

26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as "normal, natural, healthy."

27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch."

28. Eliminate prayer or any phase of religious expression in the schools on the ground that it violates the principle of "separation of church and state."

29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.

30. Discredit the American Founding Fathers. Present them as selfish aristocrats who had no concern for the "common man."

31. Belittle all forms of American culture and discourage the teaching of American history on the ground that it was only a minor part of the "big picture." Give more emphasis to Russian history since the Communists took over.

32. Support any socialist movement to give centralized control over any part of the culture--education, social agencies, welfare programs, mental health clinics, etc.

33. Eliminate all laws or procedures which interfere with the operation of the Communist apparatus.

34. Eliminate the House Committee on Un-American Activities.

36. Infiltrate and gain control of more unions.

37. Infiltrate and gain control of big business.

38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].

39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.

40. Discredit the family as an institution. Encourage promiscuity and easy divorce.

41. Emphasize the need to raise children away from the negative influence of parents. Attribute prejudices, mental blocks and retarding of children to suppressive influence of parents.

42. Create the impression that violence and insurrection are legitimate aspects of the American tradition; that students and special-interest groups should rise up and use ["]united force["] to solve economic, political or social problems.

43. Overthrow all colonial governments before native populations are ready for self-government.

44. Internationalize the Panama Canal.

45. Repeal the Connally reservation so the United States cannot prevent the World Court from seizing jurisdiction [over domestic problems. Give the World Court jurisdiction] over nations and individuals alike.



Any questions?

Norton
11-25-2008, 03:37 PM
Grasshopper I believe that list was from 1963 and they have did most of what they wanted to do on the list. The Irony is the USSR is gone and these hard core far left people are homegrown. You could substitute Britain, Germany , Canada Australia or any Western nation and the list would still be the same for about 70% of the items.

jdowney
11-25-2008, 03:39 PM
Any questions?

Yeah, why'd you start at 15? Sure, the first 14 or so dealt a lot with the Soviet Union and the cold war mentality, but as the list is from 1963, don't you think context is rather important?

jdowney
11-25-2008, 03:54 PM
I don't agree with #9. The current left wing fringe is much more vicious than it used to be, but not really more so than the right wing fringe. I'm afraid that with the passing of Buckley and his kind the extremists are returning to the Republican party, and turning it into a party that does not necessarily represent honest patriotism and American ideals - and apply those ideals universally to friend and foe alike, whether they are political, international, or just ideological.

But thats a minor beef with the underlying point he's making, that the casual association of our political figures with extremists past and present is having a negative impact on our society as a whole. That much I do agree with, so I guess I kinda half agree with #9.

Norton
11-25-2008, 04:01 PM
it seems like just about everyone in the world now is talking like a teenage girl.



Yes.. perfectly stated.

cfish
11-25-2008, 10:27 PM
Rusty my dog bit me once I bit the tip of his ear off. Needles to say he was the best damn dog a man could ever have for the next 14 years until I had to put him down. The hardest thing I had to do. I have never spared the rod or my boot on my kids ass's and they are better off for it. They are rspectful and know they better be. My son has been bullied recently in school and I gave him permission to tell the kid 1 time nicely to stop, the next time he does it after you have asked nicely to stop hit him square in the mouth, I'll take the blame for it. I'll be damned if he aint leaving this house a man. To much pussification of the American male it makes my stomach turn.

RandyCOG3
11-25-2008, 10:49 PM
Yes.. perfectly stated.

I agree, and it doesn't stop with the voice... something's wrong when I go into a customer's house, and it's a 20-something, and "he" has a closet full of expensive, un-manly shirts that nobody here would wear, and puts as much time into "his" hair as any woman would. Not saying "gay", necessarily, just androgynous...WTF is that supposed to represent? It's just disturbing.

RandyCOG3

SSwee
11-25-2008, 11:48 PM
I thought the current PC term was sensitive males. I won't mention the terms I grew up with as someone might get offended and most of you most likely grew up with the same terms unless you are still in school. :icon_biggrin:

Patria Povo
11-25-2008, 11:56 PM
I thought the current PC term was sensitive males. I won't mention the terms I grew up with as someone might get offended and most of you most likely grew up with the same terms unless you are still in school. :icon_biggrin:

Meh, I have no problem with guys who are sensitive or guys who prefer other guys ..... but I do think that we are all still GUYS and should not pretend to be sexless emasculated Ken Dolls or talk like teenage girls.

The same goes for women.

brewskzilla
11-27-2008, 10:35 AM
Yes, in Plain, basic English, This country is getting dumber by the minute. This is a great thread, but it does scare the hell out of me to think about all of that. And it's all true.

rustypirate
11-27-2008, 11:45 AM
I recently was watching a US Civil war movie, and one of the scenes stood out to me...



Mr. Evans: You ever been to Lawrence KS young man?
Jack Bull Chiles (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000240/): No, I reckon not Mr. Evans. I don't believe I'd be too welcome in Lawrence.
Mr. Evans: I didn't think so. Before this war began, my business took me there often. As I saw those northerners build that town, I witnessed the seeds of our destruction being sown.
Jack Bull Chiles (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000240/): The foundin' of that town was truly the beginnin' of the Yankee invasion.
Mr. Evans: I'm not speakin' of numbers, nor even abolitionist trouble makin'. It was the schoolhouse. Before they built their church, even, they built that schoolhouse. And they let in every tailor's son... and every farmer's daughter in that country.
Jack Bull Chiles (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000240/): Spellin' won't help you hold a plow any firmer. Or a gun either.
Mr. Evans: No, it won't Mr. Chiles. But my point is merely that they rounded every pup up into that schoolhouse because they fancied that everyone should think and talk the same free-thinkin' way they do with no regard to station, custom, propriety. And that is why they will win. Because they believe everyone should live and think just like them. And we shall lose because we don't care one way or another how they live. We just worry about ourselves.
Jack Bull Chiles (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000240/): Are you sayin', sir, that we fight for nothin'?
Mr. Evans: Far from it, Mr. Chiles. You fight for everything that we ever had, as did my son. It's just that... we don't have it anymore.

This has been and will continue to be the Liberal Agenda for all time.
Gone are the days of traditional apprentiship programs, or people proud to perform manual labor.

Anyone who does not have a college diploma hanging on their wall is looked upon as an underachiever, and why?

Why can someone who learns their trade and performs it well be respected even if they do not attend these places of "higher learning"?

I fear that it is the purpose of the school system to force every free thinking person in this country, and around the world for that matter, into copies of what the EDUCATORS think is right.

You can see it in the middle east as well, just with a different message.

Free thinking is a thing of the past. It has been replaced with conformist thinking and social stigma to anyone who does not attend the institutions that foster it.

And yes, I have a degree, and I attended University, but thankfully I was able to mature and gain a firm understanding of free thinking before I went there. I did however see the rediculous and obvious brainwashing of the young, and when I questioned the motives and methods of these "movements" I was labeled everything from racist to ignorant, simply for thinking freely and questioning their facts...

Two of the supposed mainstays of advanced education.

rifleman
11-27-2008, 12:36 PM
amen rusty, a school i said i didnt think that bush the person wasnt that bad, i got called all sorts of things. me and a friend said we supported mccain and they scoffed, and degraded a man who gave this country more than they know, and we told them, they said we were stupid. why because we have morals and can decide for ourselves? even the teacher got in and made his anti bush pro obama quotes. mind you he was very liberal and black(I mean this because lets be honest 90% of black voters voted obama), and to make the situation complete it was a art class.

jdowney
11-27-2008, 08:51 PM
I recently was watching a US Civil war movie, and one of the scenes stood out to me...


This has been and will continue to be the Liberal Agenda for all time.
Gone are the days of traditional apprentiship programs, or people proud to perform manual labor.

Anyone who does not have a college diploma hanging on their wall is looked upon as an underachiever, and why?

Why can someone who learns their trade and performs it well be respected even if they do not attend these places of "higher learning"?

I fear that it is the purpose of the school system to force every free thinking person in this country, and around the world for that matter, into copies of what the EDUCATORS think is right.

You can see it in the middle east as well, just with a different message.

Free thinking is a thing of the past. It has been replaced with conformist thinking and social stigma to anyone who does not attend the institutions that foster it.

And yes, I have a degree, and I attended University, but thankfully I was able to mature and gain a firm understanding of free thinking before I went there. I did however see the rediculous and obvious brainwashing of the young, and when I questioned the motives and methods of these "movements" I was labeled everything from racist to ignorant, simply for thinking freely and questioning their facts...

Two of the supposed mainstays of advanced education.

Nope, the purpose of the school system is to provide a basic education to the children of this country. The individual teachers in that system may or may not attempt to influence their student ideologically. Perhaps its my scientific education, but I've always evaluated what teachers said with a healthy dose of skepticism, and that is the antidote for brainwashing. I think social trends among peers is far, far more influential amongst school goers of all ages, just harder to pin down, condemn, and rail against. The school curricula are not helping with their laxness and "good enough" sort of standards, but its not some ebil yankee plot.

Perhaps the yanks building schools in Laurence Kansas was evidence that the south would loose the war, but your character got his reasoning all wrong.

rustypirate
11-28-2008, 03:07 AM
Social influence by peers is what leads to Greek Week, and other social traditions on campus, but the overall IDEALS and political agendas that are fostered in campuses are generated elswhere.

If they are not originated by the educators, then they are condoned by a lack of condemnation and allowed to proliferate.

I am sure that for the most part, the colleges of Engineering, Science, and Business don't see as much of this from the staff, but the Liberal Arts, Journalism, and Political Science factulies are rife with it.

nevada
11-28-2008, 04:20 AM
I have peers? I have friends that I have chosen or that have chosen me. The trend I have followed since Jr High school is what I like to wear, read, eat, watch and say. You get your own trend. Being honest out loud has gotten me into a lot of trouble and most likely will continue to do so. My wife is a teacher. She is appalled by the thinking of the new young teachers coming into the system. The school administrators are slaves to extreme political correctness. There has been a curriculum in place for 10 years now to teach homosexuality starting in first grade. It is still waiting, the horror is that it is there at all. I was appalled by the college professors the one year I was there, a long time ago. I respect people who deserve it on their merits, not their title or station in life. Someones tag line here was "Truth is an offense, but it is not a sin". With most it is a sin now. Too bad. The scriptures warned of the times when good would be called evil and evil called good. Nikita Kruschov said we would be destroyed from the inside, not by any outside nation. PC mindless liberal lynch mob mentality is this nations undoing. There are still good honest people throughout this land, but the majority of feel gooders will win over those who value substance. At least for a while.
These times were prophesied. No one said they would be easy.

Norton
11-28-2008, 09:07 AM
I recently was watching a US Civil war movie, and one of the scenes stood out to me...



Rusty that was very good example of what is wrong.
You have think like we do.. or we will make you. If we can't make you we will make your kids think like us.

My son's schools are like brainwashing centers. The day after the election my 12 year old sons teacher asked them to give thoughts on Obama's victory.
(My area of Virginia voted for McCain)
My son and several other students said they not pleased and began to state why. The teacher shut them down and with no shame asked for only students who were happy with the outcome to speak up. My son pursued it after class and was told by his teacher the negative comments might be considered racist or hurtful to people that supported him. He has already has a big distast for PC type thought crimes...

Both my kids have butted heads with teachers over the War Between the States.. That is.. they won't consede the Union Army were the "Good Guys" as the grade school teachers put it. And were scolded for calling the Confederate Army "Our Side"

My youngest son was making paper Gingerbread men in his 1st grade class.
He made his a camoflaged soldier with a candy cane rifle. The teacher asked him about it and then cut of the candy cane rifle, He then lied to her about the Mexican style banodlier of bullets draping the Gingerbread mans's chest.
He told me the teacher asked him what are those and he said Candy..
But they are machinegun bullets daddy.. I fooled her she was going to cut them too.
It was funny but me and my wife were sad about it.. They are teaching a young child to lie about his true feelings They are being trained to be cynical as they are learning you must go along with the teachers's polictical veiws or be shut down.

My older son grew weary of Black History, Hispainc History, Womens history month.. (He is half Mexican) He and other students asked the teacher when are we going to have White history month or Male history month..
He was told every month is White Male histroy month.. He said oh really can you give some examples.. Shut down yet again.. In our house We tell them there is no Black history, no White history, no Hispanic history no male or female history.. Just American History.. If a black guy invented something then an American invented it and we should be glad he did. When he was young I used to drill him with a game called 'what country invented it'
i.e. Who invented the Steamboat, train radio tank motorcar, machinegun submarine.. balloon airplane telegraph telephone guided missle, plasma,(fake blood as he called it)
You get the game... It was simple. He loved to say USA and was proud of anything we invented first. He did not learn the hue or skin tone of the men who did the inventing just their country. He develpoed a pride in being an American early. As he should

jdowney
11-28-2008, 09:14 AM
Social influence by peers is what leads to Greek Week, and other social traditions on campus, but the overall IDEALS and political agendas that are fostered in campuses are generated elswhere.

I recall Bush vs Clinton, recycling, global warming and a whole host of other topics being subjects of social discussion and a lot of people being swayed not by the voice of reason in the discussion, but by what opinions the most popular students thought. It is nothing more than human nature to want to be liked by those that one likes, this causes their opinions to hold more sway than a rational argument might. Yes, it also leads to Greek Week and other such foolishness.


If they are not originated by the educators, then they are condoned by a lack of condemnation and allowed to proliferate.

So it sounds like even if an educator is not pushing their own ideology, they are still at fault for not condemning ideas you disagree with, there by allowing them to proliferate? I'm sorry, but that is not the educator's job, an educator should not be pushing any ideology so much as providing the students with the basic materials to arrive at their own conclusions. The most effective teachers I've known did this, trusting their students to use their heads just a little bit. I will grant you that the basic materials they're teaching today are not of the quality that they once were, and I shudder to think the quality may have slipped even further since I was in school.


I am sure that for the most part, the colleges of Engineering, Science, and Business don't see as much of this from the staff, but the Liberal Arts, Journalism, and Political Science factulies are rife with it.

I would say at all rather than "for the most part". Such behavior was unheard of in my department, if for no other reason, there was no class time to waste on stuff that did not relate to the subject at hand. In some of the liberal arts subjects I can imagine that it might come up. Given that hindsight is 20/20, perhaps such attempts were made in the liberal arts classes I was required to take, and perhaps I just dismissed such facile attempts out of hand and forgot them. I do tend to trust my memory though, so I'm going to go so far as to say they never happened in any of my classes.

Can schools have changed so much in a mere 15-20 years? I doubt it, not without an organized, controlled, and designed effort. I do not believe that effort existists, based on my general contempt for conspiracy theories.

Patria Povo
11-28-2008, 10:12 AM
Can schools have changed so much in a mere 15-20 years? I doubt it, not without an organized, controlled, and designed effort. I do not believe that effort existists, based on my general contempt for conspiracy theories.

In spite of all the hoopla, I think most good university humanities departments encourage students to develop their own ideas and to think critically. It may be true that academic tend to be more libertarian and more left in their personal politics, I really don't think there is any secret conspiracy to brainwash the classroom. In fact, students are now exposed to a far more diverse range of ideas and schools of thought than ever before.

I'm not thrilled by the rise of post-structuralism over the past 20 years within many disciplines because of it's potential for deconstructive any basic concept of 'right' and 'wrong' and relativizing all sense of morality (however one wishes to define it). But that's not to say that the current metatheories are being forced on anyone - it's just a popular analytic framework at the moment. If nothing else, it at least challenges the students by making them argue against Foucault, Derrida Barthes, etc. - whether from left, right or another angle.